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Plane vector flipping

Caemgen
Can anyone explain why the vector of the plane is flipping?

I'm not hitting a surface/simulator that the part is sitting on, I am hitting the part.

Plane facing straight up in the air, hits straight down on Z.

Honestly, I'm not doing it, my guy 30miles away is and I remoted in.
The program worked yesterday.

Today, it refuses to keep the vector.
Did a restart of the PC.
Did a restart of the PC and the controller.

2021.2 sp4 

STARTUP =ALIGNMENT/START,RECALL:USE_PART_SETUP,LIST=YES
ALIGNMENT/END
MODE/MANUAL
PREHIT/0.0197
RETRACT/0.0197
FORMAT/TEXT,OPTIONS, ,HEADINGS,SYMBOLS, ;NOM,TOL,MEAS,DEV,OUTTOL, ,
LOADPROBE/2021X2X72
TIP/T1A0B0, SHANKIJK=0, 0, 1, ANGLE=0
PLN1 =FEAT/PLANE,CARTESIAN,TRIANGLE
THEO/<-0.1212,-0.0611,0>,<0,0,1>
ACTL/<-0.1212,-0.0611,0>,<0,0,1>
MEAS/PLANE,4
HIT/BASIC,NORMAL,<-2.4829,-0.242,0>,<0,0,1>,<-2.4829,-0.242,0>,USE THEO=YES
HIT/BASIC,NORMAL,<-0.4623,-2.4556,0>,<0,0,1>,<-0.4623,-2.4556,0>,USE THEO=YES
HIT/BASIC,NORMAL,<2.6497,-0.0812,0>,<0,0,1>,<2.6497,-0.0812,0>,USE THEO=YES
HIT/BASIC,NORMAL,<-0.1893,2.5343,0>,<0,0,1>,<-0.1893,2.5343,0>,USE THEO=YES
ENDMEAS/


Vector of plane prior to taking the hits manually above.
Vecor of plane after taking the hits manually below. 

STARTUP =ALIGNMENT/START,RECALL:USE_PART_SETUP,LIST=YES
ALIGNMENT/END
MODE/MANUAL
PREHIT/0.0197
RETRACT/0.0197
FORMAT/TEXT,OPTIONS, ,HEADINGS,SYMBOLS, ;NOM,TOL,MEAS,DEV,OUTTOL, ,
LOADPROBE/2021X2X72
TIP/T1A0B0, SHANKIJK=0, 0, 1, ANGLE=0
PLN1 =FEAT/PLANE,CARTESIAN,TRIANGLE
THEO/<-0.1212,-0.0611,0>,<0,0,1>
ACTL/<15.4765,24.4678,-27.5789>,<0.0000363,-0.0002564,-1>
MEAS/PLANE,4
HIT/BASIC,NORMAL,<-2.4829,-0.242,0>,<0,0,1>,<15.6659,21.776,-27.5783>,USE THEO=YES
HIT/BASIC,NORMAL,<-0.4623,-2.4556,0>,<0,0,1>,<17.9232,25.2091,-27.579>,USE THEO=YES
HIT/BASIC,NORMAL,<2.6497,-0.0812,0>,<0,0,1>,<15.348,26.9283,-27.5796>,USE THEO=YES
HIT/BASIC,NORMAL,<-0.1893,2.5343,0>,<0,0,1>,<12.9688,23.9577,-27.5788>,USE THEO=YES
ENDMEAS/
  • If it were me, I would try either shelling the program or recreating the plane all together.

    You could also try opening a new program and probing a plane and see if it creates it with the correct vector. If it doesn't, then maybe a machine setting was somehow changed?
  • I did that.

    What I posted is from a new program that ONLY has manually measuring a plane.

    This was the final time, after rebooting the PC and the controller.

    I created a new program.
    Import step model.
    probe mode.
    click face of step model four times.
    hit end key.
    get a plane that is correct.
    CTRL + E on that plane
    manually probe four hits.
    vector flips.

    yee haw



    Could a machine setting have been changed, or changed during some power fluctuation even though I'm on an UPS? Sure, it is windows afterall.

    Any clue what setting?


    I also now asked the guy to reset the probes and requalify the entire file. I can't imagine that is it, but I don't have anything to lose. If that fixes it, I'll post that it was a corrupt probe file.
  • The actuals are a long way from the theoreticals.

    Is he probing the right area?
  • I have seen gremlins like this pop up using command mode which is why I avoid it.

    My advise:

    Don't waste time on a part of the software that is known to be quirky. This approach has/will work in the past and thats great!...but it isn't now...so I wouldn't lose sleep over it/pull your hair out trying to understand why...would just delete the manual alignment & make it a readpoint. Significantly reduces your operator's chances of f*c*ing up while making prg easier to useSlight smile

    I know this didn't answer your question...regardless hope it helped
  • I have experience this. Its was always a cad issue. when you probe on part are there two sides of metal?

    I found that if I click on another surface and then reclick on the surface you want that should correct it. I have had to do this a few times. You can verify it by which surface hi-lites when you click on it..
  • in reply to DAN_M
    I do use readpoints, but this is a turn part with a 4" bore, so eyeballing the center with the probe would be heinous.

    But I do get your point!
  • in reply to Paul Sarrach
    The part is VERY thick below my clicking... 4+ inches.

    It is highlighting the correct surface, and the arrows are showing the propper vector.

    I have absolutely seen this before on thinner models, also in manifold holes, where it doesn't take the click on the hole I'm in but in some cross-hole.

    Miserable to deal with, but still better than Tutor for Windows where there was no model and I had to do everything in my head with a calculator!
  • After redoing the probe file, it is working.

    Is it only working for a little while, or was the probe file corrupted... that is yet to see.

    But the information at my disposal right now is that CLEARING all the probe data in the probe file and then requalifying the probe has fixed it.

    We had requalified previously without clearing the data, that did nothing.

    If I don't post again, for future reference, that would mean it was a corrupted probe file.

    If I'm back in four hours or tomorrow, it wasn't the probe lol.
  • in reply to Caemgen
    The model seems to be working ok on selection.

    I used the model for the next operation, so I selected the same datum surface and hit it, and didn't have the vector flip.

    Every import could be slightly different though, so it could be a model problem.
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